This comes from Bristol Live in 2017:
The white, male, decidedly privileged, elite.
These were the people who were really tipped into Bristol harbour yesterday.
Them, and their political friends.
No wonder the government is annoyed.
And staggering that this happened so recently.
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Was the bringing down of the Berlin Wall a “criminal act”?
Or the toppling of statues of Saddam Hussein?
Or of statues of Lenin in the former Eastern Block countries?
We put people on pedistals because we want to promote them and their actions.
How could a staue of a slave trader still be in a place of prominence in a British city in 2020????!!!!!
Feel proud of those Bristolians. If the authority isn’t going to do the right thing, then “the people” have to do it for them.
Not only was the statue prominent but there has clearly been a cult of veneration of this man and an annual procession. Disgusting.
I’m glad that these top-hatted toffs, as Richard says, got tipped into Bristol Harbour.
I’ve found the way to get even with the toffs is to get educated, work hard and rise above them..for me that and a tough working class upbringing scares the living daylights out of the posh privileged lot. That said of those I know quite a few are alright. You learn over time not to judge people..
Forgive me but I had no idea that this god awful procession/commemoration took place until I read it here.
Is it any wonder Neo-liberalism has done so well in the UK?
Speaking as a middle aged white male accountant I think removing the statue of this monster is long overdue.
This is on a par with today’s article on the racial abuse of a black female MP in the Guardian. Mindless behaviour!
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jun/08/labour-mp-dawn-butler-threatened-after-defending-black-lives-matter-protests
Of course if these abusers were subject to being kidnapped and forced to pick fruit on a farm in the UK for no wages they’d be the first writing to their MP! What wretched parenting produced these individuals!
White men in top hats? At a church service to commemorate philanthropy? How terrible. Shouldn’t be allowed. (Although, frankly, it does look decidedly like something from another era, and probably best left there.)
I’ll just note that each of these charities was founded decades after Colston’s death, to do philanthropic works in Bristol.
* https://www.anchorsociety.co.uk/history/
* https://www.dolphin-society.org.uk/history
* https://gratefulsociety.org/history/
That said, no doubt many of the merchants involved in the 18th century were themselves involved in the slave trade.
Colston himself undoubtedly engaged in the slave trade for 12 of his 85 years, from 1680 to 1692, although it is not clear to me how much of his fortune derived from it, as he was active as a merchant for other goods before and after. Quite how he reconciled the iniquitous business of slavery with his averred piety I am not sure, but see http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1690-1715/member/colston-edward-ii-1636-1721 for a more balanced view.
Just to put into context the 80,000 or so people transported by the Royal African Company during his period of involvement with it – a terrible thing, no doubt, and many died on the journey, as did many of the seamen crewing the vessels – but British ships were responsible for transporting about 3m of the 12m Africans slaves taken to the Americas, mostly in the 18th century, years after Colston was dead.
It is very easy to say: “Slave trader. Bad man. Damnatio memoriae.” But it all looks a bit more nuanced than that to me. (Perhaps easier for me to say as a member of the white male elite. I should check my privilege.)
Andrew.
We can’t change the past. But quite why a slave trader is , quite literally, “put on a pedestal” in the 21st century, is beyond me!?
I hope the statue ends up in the M Shed next to a video of “him” ending up in the docks. Will add to Bristol folklore and give a context of who he was and the city’s wider history with the slave trade.
He was put on a pedestal in the 19th century. Probably, the statue should have been removed to a museum several years ago.
Perhaps a more interesting question is, why was a statue of the slave trader and plantation owner Robert Milligan re-erected at West India Docks in 1997 with no added contextual information to explain who he was and what he did. If I were at the Museum of London Docklands, I would be giving urgent attention to moving it back inside the museum…
Andrew.
Yes, I understand that he wasn’t put on his pedestal in the 21st century, but why he was still there until the weekend is beyond me.
That some at the City Council didn’t see a problem with him being there speaks volumes.
On the actual toppling of the statue. It may not change the world, but it does make me smile. No-one was hurt, and what I feel as the correct action was taken. (Removal of the statue). To then dump him in the docks was pure drama. It will go down in Bristolian folklore when the dust has settled.
🙂
Come on, he tripped and accidentally fell into the dock….these things happen, you know….
@Andrew
Agree entirely. Pretty much every National Trust property we’ve ever visited is implicated in the slave trade.
That’s why it’s (sort of) nice to understand how some of our ancestors were actually also victims of it:
http://www.progressivepulse.org/brexit/subverted-by-thuggery-or-are-we-living-in-revolutionary-times
“From 1680 he became heavily involved in the slave trade, from which he made the bulk of his fortune”
Indeed, that is what it says, but I’ve not seen a thorough analysis of his sources of wealth, if one is even possible now. Compare https://historicengland.org.uk/listing/the-list/list-entry/1202137 – “The details of precisely how Colston’s fortune was accumulated are not recorded, but his business interests were wide. Besides trading extensively in various commodities, including cloth and wine, he acted as a money-lender, and had interests in the West Indian island of St Kitts. In 1680 he became a shareholder in the Royal African Company…”
* from which he made the bulk of his fortune*
I don’t think there’s any real doubt as to how slaving impacted his finances.
For reference, I feel that currently many historical figures are judged purely through a lens of today’s morals, without considering the prevailing attitudes of the time. It lacks nuance and completely disregards any positive effect such people may have had. However, this is not an excusal of racism and slavery, but as others have pointed out, we need to understand history to avoid making the same mistakes (and also to repeat those bits that are worthy of applause).
But, BLM has certianly been a period of reflection for myself. I’ve come round to agreeing with the removal (or preferably removal to a museum) of statues of people of modern-incompatible morals, such as slaver philanthropists, with a good historical note attached.
I’m not sure I agree with PSR’s revisionist ideas, although I’m well aware that I may have mis-understood what PSR means by revising history.
I feel that the best way is to provide all information about an historical figure, highlighting the wrong they did (even, or especially, if it wasn’t neccessarily deemed wrong at the time) but also the good that they might have done for their local area. I personally went to a CoE high school and 6th Form, which was set up by a local merchant and slave trader. That fact was never hidden from us as pupils; we were encouraged to consider the ethical ramifications of the school’s founding.
Anyway, before I head off on too much of a tangent; revisionist suggests expunging of undesirable information [to me], which is the exact opposite of what should be aimed for. Although I’m happy to have a different interpretation explained to me 🙂
See, that’s the problem with trying to make nuanced arguments – quite often you end up saying things like this without reflecting on what it means.
Tens of thousands of people had their humanity stripped away, their liberty, their rights to anything at all, and in many cases their actual life . . . but. But this man wasn’t the only one doing it? Sure. But this man didn’t even make most of his fortune doing it? Maybe. But he created all sorts of charities and so forth? Good for him. But he was responsible for doing one of the most horrible things that can be done to any human being, over and over and over again, for /years/? There’s the problem.
Colston was surely a very complex man, as was his time (and the whole period during which the slave trade occurred). He’s definitely worth learning about from a historical perspective, but do you /really/ think the world needs uncritical acclaim of people who do such horrible things?
Do those men in their top hats include a commemoration of the human lives that Colston and his company destroyed in their annual service? Do they include a visit to the graves of the human beings that Colston and his company sold in their little procession? No? Then they’re not even slightly nuanced.
If you want to demand nuanced consideration of history from angry protesters, shouldn’t we demand so much more from wealthy, powerful people like these?
Well said
Simon Fowler.
You are spot on. I couldn’t have put it any better.
I also find Andrew’s line
“and many died on the journey, as did many of the seamen crewing the vessels”
a bit “problematic”.
Equating the suffering of the victim’s with that of the perpetrators seems a bit perverse to me.
The Trans Atlantic Slave Trade was one of humanities greatest crimes, if not the greatest. Yet, it’s significants seems to get ignored or down played. It’s legacy is with us today.
I can’t imagine people accepting the “downgrading” of The Holocaust in the same way.
“do you /really/ think the world needs uncritical acclaim of people who do such horrible things?”
No. Of course not, and I don’t see how you can think that might be my position. It is the very opposite of what I think. I think we should learn about such people so we understand our own history better. He was very far from a saint, but also he was not the devil incarnate either.
If some posh blokes want to prance around in their fancy clothes and pat each on the back for raising some cash for charity, I’m not going to stop them. I’d also be very happy if some people want to counter-demonstrate peacefully to explain the problematic legacy of this guy who died nearly 300 years ago. We very much should hope for a more nuanced consideration of history from everyone, angry protesters and posh blokes in hats alike, rather than trying to box everything into Trump-like boxes marked “great” or “very bad”.
But we should stop them if they think this gives them the right to interfere in democratic processes, and it seems that the Merchant Venturers do have some very odd ‘rights’
Thay also seem remarkably aligned to a single political party
Yes Andrew, people like Colston are limited by the times they live in – what is acceptable, what is not acceptable, the science of the time etc., caged by history you might say.
But when for all this time onwards we have lived with a greater knowledge, more awareness and understanding of the cruelty, is it really excusable to erect tributes to these people without considering the darker areas of their existence? That is our job, the ‘follow on’ society – it is us who have failed in this instance (well, some of us). The people who dumped the statue in the harbour have put something right that should have been corrected anyway.
The plain answer is no. What is wrong with revisionism? How do we learn from the past if we do not revise it? How fated are we to repeat it if we don’t? My organisation has anti-slavery elements in our procurement policies? Today in 2020! Now why do you think that is Andrew?
And what if it was YOUR race that had been subjugated to such a degree as the Africans had? What would you feel then, in a society that was supposed to be equal? I don’t think you’d like it. It would hurt. The injustice would linger. And why should it not? Acknowledging pain and saying sorry does help. That’s all I want, a balanced view – not denial.
“is it really excusable to erect tributes to these people without considering the darker areas of their existence?”
Of course not and I was not arguing for that. Quite the opposite.
“Acknowledging pain and saying sorry does help. That’s all I want, a balanced view — not denial.”
Absolutely. We have quite a lot to be sorry about. More importantly, what are we going to do to make amends? I’m not convinced that pulling down a statue and dumping it in the river helps very much.
Thanks for the post – that picture paints a thousand words.
Little is ever achieved without direct action and it seems that this statue was (for Bristol, at least) emblematic of a lot more than just Colston as a historical figure from 300 years ago. It represents a statement about today….. and those in power should reflect carefully before wheeling out the stock phrases about vandalism, criminal action etc.. The narrative we choose to promote is not made any more/less true by our act of promotion……. but it says an awful lot about us, the promoter.
That said, I am concerned that labelling people “good” of “bad” always fails to capture the complexity of people….. there are just people who do good and bad things. Churchill was a poor Home Secretary, poor Chancellor and a rascist but he did inspire a nation at war. Aung san Suu Kyi was a steadfast opponent of a military dictatorship but, once in power, failed (at best) the Rohingya people. We should take care who we choose to raise up……. as it will always lead to disappointment.
For those people with Twitter, this is a very enlightening thread
https://twitter.com/mat8iou/status/1269896135113674753?s=21
Well worth reading. Recommended to anyone. I retweeted it saying so
Again, is it any wonder Neo-liberalism has done so well in the UK?
“These were the people who were really tipped into Bristol harbour yesterday.
Them, and their political friends.”
I understand the metaphor, and its all well and good that that’s what you take from it.
But i’d like to make a general point, tangental to your blog post, that i really can’t see the statue dumping having any real effect, or making the politicians worried. What was Priti patels response? the standard ‘ call em thugs, more police force, we’ll make your life a misery if you try us’.
And it’ll work.
The problem is none of these protests or statue chucking is getting to the heart of the matter, which is, as it almost always is the case, is wealth and income inequality. I haven’t done the cross section regression, but my hypothesis would be that the local authority areas with the highest % of non-white population, also have the lowest levels of income.
If they have a problem with police brutality and legislation, why aren’t the large gatherings making a scene outside the supreme court in London. Or focusing their efforts on raising awareness about inequality.
Unless these protestors and pressure groups and statue throwers focus their attention at the real structural sources of power and hierarchy which govern the laws that marginalise minorities, their actions are for nothing – give this a few more weeks, people will have forgotten about this and we’ll be back to more covid news.
It would have been a MUCH more powerful message if they had knocked down Thatchers statue and chucked that in the Thames. (not people from Bristol, i mean in general)
It took William Wilberforce 46 years to achieve the abolition of slavery in Parliament in 1833. He would need to be 260 years old to carry on campaigning to stop the British from electing the current racist government!
Fairly obvious the general reaction to Starmer’s statement is largely that of a nation with a slave mentality unable to see how the oppression of slavery links to the outlook and behaviour of this current government. Starmer needn’t have said anything. I think after his reaction he’s yet another Labour dud! It’s what he failed to say that matters!
I agree with you Helen, the general response makes me think of the Stockholm syndrome, people identifying with their oppressors, like people living in poverty voting Tory, doesn’t make sense. And as for Starmer’s response – well-said.
I disagree – what else was Starmer going to say?
A prime minister in waiting cannot endorse breaking the law
He made an appropriate and balanced judgement
In his shoes that is what I would have said
Knocking down the statute, burning the Union Jack, defacing the statue of Churchill sound great to the middle class 20 yr old university rebels until you realise it really doesn’t help the underlying cause at all – public opinion is very much against this (yougov poll has nearly 90% against) and BLM organisers have tried to distance themselves from violent and public order offences..quite a few of the kids will soon get a police record and that is no joke…Starmer is absolutely right and those which fan the flames need to give their head a shake
“A prime minister in waiting cannot endorse breaking the law”..but the current Prime Mincer can – by condoning Dominic Goebbels (illegal) actions during “lock down for the serfs – tories do what they want”.
As for the statue – we can learn lessons from Glasgow, where Wellingtons figure on horseback sports a permanent traffic cone (on Welly & on his horse). The council have long given up taking it off. Colston’s statue would have looked good in a pink tutu, traffic cone on head & the inscription changed to “Slaver Tw.t”.
As for the top hat & tails mob – tutu & tights – could be a big tourist attraction.
Ridicule works. That said, I’d have happliy pulled the thing down had I been there.
I would have happily pulled it down too
But as leader of the opposition I could not have said that
I may have been stronger than Starmer on the failure of local Tories on the issue
I may have attacked the role of the Merchant Venturers who seem central to this
I may have made it clear that there was organised oppression in play here
And yes, I would have made clear that the statue had to go
But I could not as leader of the opposition have said law breaking is OK and knowing the UK electorate hope to be elected
And I would rather him than Johnson
That may be a low hurdle but it’s the only hurdle I’ve got
Should we demolish the Karl Marx memorial in Highgate cemetary because of his antisemetic views?
No
Views are not the same as slave trading
Both may be repugnant, but if you cannot see that one is worse then you are not being objective
I see
So preaching hatred of Jews should not be condemned in the same way as actually doing something about that hated?
Statues of those who argued in favour of the slave trade can stand, only those who actively engaged in it should be pulled down?
You don’t think preaching hatred has any enabling effect? I’m sure the BLM movement would hold a different view.
Of course I am nit indifferent
But you are making a false distinction to an answer to a question
And I am interested in solving the issue and not in playing rhetorical games
Now go and address the issue – what are you going to do about your concern, assuming pulling down every statue will still not solve the issue, which it won’t?
I wasn’t aware that Marx had any antisemitic views. I may have missed them. He was of course a Jew himself.
Marx is usually a Jewish name, like Christensen and both given for anti-Semitic reasons so I was also surprised by the suggestion
Daniel Mistu.
There is an argument that maybe no-one should be put on a pedestal?
We all have our sins and virtues, after all.
Statues of people, past and present, are a strange phenomena, when we step back and think about them?????
They are
Why does anyone need such a memorial
And we are all flawed
@Daniel Mistu
you’re exagerrating wildly to try and make a point.
Marx hardly “preached hatred of Jews”……infact there’s scholarly debate over whether he did hold anti semitic views strictly, or not, or whether it was just his style of writing etc….
whatever the conclusion, its a long way from anything Colston did with slavery. Big difference between condeming thousands to slavery, versus some writing to convey a point about how money can change people.
if you hate Marx that much, feel free to go and try and tear down the statue……
Although Marx championed revolution, I’m not sure he envisaged the mass starvations endured in the Soviet Union or China or the terror killings of Stalin and other so-called socialist victors wrongly done in his name. I somehow don’t think Marx endorsed that.
Colton is a different proposition altogether in my view – the fact that we know more now means we need a 365 degree view of the man and his work which acknowledges his good and bad points and that there is some sort of atonement.
Since you are apparently into atonement for Marx, one can assume that you find atonement somewhat agreeable so with this in mind Daniel, what sort of atonement would you like to see for all the suicides and miserable poverty meted out by this Tory Government since 2010?
Over to you.
Let’s attempt to frame the issue a little clearer or better. What does the Black Lives Matter movement want? How about Equity of Justice for All through the Law and Order system? Sounds reasonable don’t you think?
William Wilberforce as an MP began that process 233 years ago after it was first initiated by Quakers. Now along comes Keir Starmer after nearly two and half centuries and tells this BLM movement you need to have more patience with the Law and Order system!
In framing or message terms all Starmer had to do was say something along the following lines:-
“I recognise your anger in throwing that symbolic piece of metal into Bristol harbour because it represents lack of progress in Equity of Justice for All through the Law and Order system in this country and if you elect me as leader of the Labour Party to office I will set this right.”
Instead he’s delivered the message that he places the very Law and Order system that’s failed them as being more important. Sure everybody knows such a system is vital to democracy but what’s important here is the recognition its been failing for far too long, police killings, police brutality, Windrush, treatment of immigrants from the EU, the list goes on and on!
This is why I say Labour has elected another dud to be their leader!
Here we go Starmer finally sort of starts to gets round to it after muddying the waters!
“The Labour leader, Keir Starmer, says George Floyd’s death must be a “catalyst for change” and that his party stands with those opposing racism and oppression.”
https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2020/jun/09/uk-protests-black-lives-matter-colston-statue-rhodes-live
Susan Brown, a Labour councilor at Oxford City Council, got it light years ahead of Keir Starmer! Here’s what she said today about the Rhodes statute at Oxford University and the key words are “malign symbolism”:-
“I have today written to Oriel College to invite them to apply for planning permission to remove the statue, as it is a Grade II* listed building. Typically such actions are only allowed in the most exceptional of circumstances.
But these are exceptional circumstances, and as a city council we are keen to work with Oriel to help them find the right balance between the laws that protect our historic buildings and the moral obligation to reflect on the malign symbolism of this statue.”
https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2020/jun/09/uk-protests-black-lives-matter-colston-statue-rhodes-live
As I argued in a previous comment the “malign symbolism” is three fold a failure to understand the concept of “Equity of Justice,” the failure to understand this has to be implemented through your country’s “Law and Order System” and finally that implementation must not drag its heels.
Much of the concept of “Equity of Justice” can be found in the American Declaration of Independence (See Danielle Allen’s book “Our Declaration.”). The term “just powers” used in that declaration is a direct reference to the “Law and Order System”! I’m sure before, during and after the American Revolutionary War statutes of George III were torn done. Shamefully many Americans have not understood the wide scope of the Declaration of Independence especially the concept of “Equity of Justice.” But this is true of the British and other nationalities indeed I would go further that most human beings don’t understand that it’s embedded as a foundation of life because it facilitates the development of complexity in life forms.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/247759661_Evolution_of_Parental_Caregiving
That is a good approach
But give Starmer a chance – planning permission for a statue was not his highest priority in the first few weeks as leader
Could I make a few comments which will no doubt be unpopular & I’ll be dubbed ‘racist’ which is what seems to happen to people with a different view.
– if you were running the Rhodes Scholarship you would probably want to consider whether your funding of the scholars was worth it anymore as some of the ‘Rhodes must fall’ people are actually Rhodes scholars. Clearly people cannot want the tainted money from the fund.
– I’m part of a shielding household & have hardly been out for over 12 weeks & the probability of more & more weeks in the same lockdown. Meanwhile, all the BLM protestors & Oxford protesters can flaunt the law with no action, & there is potential for a ‘second wave’ which will keep us locked up here for months. Worth it for a few statues though.
– I hope people are ready for the inevitable backlash. The very worst of the far right will seize on this as is already happening in Hoddesdon.
– I”m a white British man who has employed many people of all races, colours, religions over all parts of the UK. I’m not and never have been a racist & I’m tired of being told I am. The main backlash will probably come from my group I suspect.
End of rant!
–
The proof is the pudding that one incident of throwing Edward Colston into Bristol harbour has now led to Labour councils doing the following:-
“All Labour councils in England and Wales to review statues and monuments
Labour councils across England and Wales will begin reviewing monuments and statues in their towns and cities following the tearing down of the Edward Colston statue in Bristol.
The Local Government Association’s (LGA) Labour group announced on Tuesday it has asked Labour council leaders to work with their communities to review “the appropriateness” of monuments and statues in their areas. ”
https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2020/jun/09/uk-protests-black-lives-matter-colston-statue-rhodes-live
This development whilst good in one sense is also sad in my opinion because it’s resulted in Keir Starmer leading from behind! We can only hope this is a misjudgement on his part and he’ll exercise better judgement on highly emotional issues in the future.
Hi Richard, you mention local Tories on the issue.
Quite the staement from one today!!? 😮
https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bristol-news/edward-colston-a-hero-bristol-4205516
Mind you, he had to resign in 2001 over a pet goliwog, when he was local leader. Seems very popular in that ward though, even beat a mainstream Tory candidate a while back.
I think my comment was justified
I quite agree.