Sometimes stating the obvious is necessary.
We need police.
We need laws enforced.
And just as much we need their presence in communities — where I suspect they do a lot more simple offering help and direction than they do law enforcement.
I am well aware that there are those on the right who think the police — and even law — can be privatised.
That’s wrong. A coherent system of law and order underpins a society. Only government can command and direct such a service. Only government can pay for it.
That’s the Joy of Tax.
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Agreed that we need Law and Order (not just as a TV show) and that this requires some form of tax-funded government involvement.
But this statement “Only government can pay for it” is plain wrong. There is a $34 billion private security industry to prove it. It is also one of the fastest-growing legitimate business in the nation.
@Ted G
And most people rightly see these security services as what they are – a menacing threat to defend the private property rights of an elite
Thanks, but no thanks, ever
Actually Richard, the biggest single customer for these services is….. the Government (used as a broad term), which retains these firms for schools, hospitals, public buildings, transport facilites (many airports still have private contractors), etc, etc., etc.. So much for the idea that the industry is there for an elite only.
Hmm, not sure how I feel about private police forces – maybe we should privatise the judiciary. Maybe the house of Lords and the Monarchy.
Perhaps we should privatise the Cabinate as well.
I jest, of course.
On a more serious note, what happens when a company running a police force undergoes a leverage buyout and then falls over due to being overgeared?
Hmm let me think – gun to the head-society will break down-too important to fail etc etc – we’ll have to bail them out.
Now, remind me where have I heard this logic before?
The checks on employees in these private security firms is extremely lax. I expect all the employers are interested in is can they be paid the minimum wage? yes, oh good! can you start tonight.
I’m no fan of the police, arrogant bunch mostly, but I’d rather have an arrogant copper than a totally crooked one.
Actually many of the traffic wardens in England work for private comapnies owned by by financial investors, and acquired with substantial debt packages. Some have gone bust, and were taken over by their lenders. End-users (if on can say so) did not notice the difference.
Actually, the average salary in the private security industry is well in excess of $27,000. Ok, this is not millionaire compensation, but it is well above minimum, average and median wage in our nation.
Actually, the average salary in the private security industry is well in excess of $27,000. Ok, this is not millionaire compensation, but it is well above minimum, average and median wage in our nation.
Not in the UK, a Police Constable starts on £23,259 which will rise to £31k after 5 years but the average security guard earns between £13,096 – £18,332
It’s a well known fact here that many working in the security arena are not properly checked and many have criminal records.
“Only Government can command or direct such a service”
Pay for it, sure, but do we really want Governments commanding and directing the Police force? Too much of that does not lead down a happy path.
With the inevitable rise in inequality that will result from the coming cuts, I doubt even the Tories will cut back on police.
After all, who will protect them from us?
@Ted G
Are you bonkers? Perhaps you haven’t heard about the private ‘security’ firms in Iraq? Basically killers for hire.
@AVI
Who else then?
Militias?
What esle but democracy?
@Alex S
I think you know the answer to your question to Ted
He has proven the only viable answer countless times here
Alex, Ted’s point was actually very pertinent; Richard made the statement that only the government can pay for security services, and Ted provided 34 billion (probably closer to 50 billion) reasons why he is misguided.
As for Iraq, while there have been issues with security contractors there, one also needs to recall that there have been many fatalities in the industry. Many of us can still remember the charred and dismembered body of a security contractor dragged from the back of a truck by terrorists.
Richard, your random isnsults to contributors would fail your own moderation policy. What exactly is their point?
Jason
They clearly do not fail the moderation policy
Their purpose is to highlight the fact that many who contribute here are from the anarcho capitalist libertarian right who seek to destroy society
These people are a) mad b) dangerous c) promote ideas from way beyond the fringes of what society accepts and yet d) seem to be threatening that society
And if I seek to highlight their madenes and danger I think it’s entirely within my rights to do so
I am a democrat
An upholder of the rights of all people
And I want to point out that the right wigf blogosphere is populated by many who oppose both democracy and equal human rights
Maybe you’re one of them
Richard, my comment was not politically motivated.
I fail to see how someone can be “a) mad b) dangerous c) promote ideas from way beyond the fringes of what society accepts and yet d) seem to be threatening that society”
When he/she points out to you that there is a perfecty legitimate (in the eyes of Congress and every state of the Union) $50 billion industry providing security services that are complementary to the Government’s.
This is pushing it a little too far.
It is not, I think, the Joy of tax, but the Privilege one should feel in being able to pay. It is a privilege to be a part of a working, essentially non-coercive community, that uses taxes to provide essential services that cannot be replicated by self-interested for profit enterprises. We must shake off the archaic belief that taxes are being taken from us by an arbitrary and potentially violent power that uses taxes to enrich themselves. Taxes are the glue of our social contract. I propose a new political party: THE PRIVILEGE TO PAY PARTY aka P CUBED.
@bhb
You’re welcome here