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	<title>Comments on: Who are the Taxpayer’s Alliance?</title>
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	<link>http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/</link>
	<description>Richard Murphy on tax and corporate accountability</description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 12 Oct 2008 02:14:21 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Tax Research LLP</title>
		<link>http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-495768</link>
		<dc:creator>Tax Research LLP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Sep 2008 09:59:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-495768</guid>
		<description>Edward

A fool could say that

Anyone with an ounce of sense could not

What are these pseudo jobs? Nurses, teachers, the police, the forces, health and safety that mean you can buy food and expect to eat it without being ill? 

Tell me who the one in 4 are? And don't say 'admin'. All services need admin.

Richard</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Edward</p>
<p>A fool could say that</p>
<p>Anyone with an ounce of sense could not</p>
<p>What are these pseudo jobs? Nurses, teachers, the police, the forces, health and safety that mean you can buy food and expect to eat it without being ill? </p>
<p>Tell me who the one in 4 are? And don&#8217;t say &#8216;admin&#8217;. All services need admin.</p>
<p>Richard</p>
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		<title>By: edward sheridan</title>
		<link>http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-495744</link>
		<dc:creator>edward sheridan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Sep 2008 08:49:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-495744</guid>
		<description>can anyone deny that at least one person in every four in this country is employed in a government tax funded pseudo ''job''.  That small businesses are screwed into the ground in order to provide cushy lifestyles for the laziest sections of society and that quangos are totally out of control and that the final salary pensions promised to government employees is impossible to fund without massive levels of tax.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>can anyone deny that at least one person in every four in this country is employed in a government tax funded pseudo &#8221;job&#8221;.  That small businesses are screwed into the ground in order to provide cushy lifestyles for the laziest sections of society and that quangos are totally out of control and that the final salary pensions promised to government employees is impossible to fund without massive levels of tax.</p>
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		<title>By: Rory Meakn</title>
		<link>http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-466774</link>
		<dc:creator>Rory Meakn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2008 03:14:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-466774</guid>
		<description>A few comments:

1. "her £16,000 a year job"... "She simply won’t notice the difference. Her family as a whole will be £88 a year worse off". Fortunately, I earn more than £16k a year, but sadly I'm not rich enough not to even notice £88. I suspect on her salary, she's not rich enough, either.

2. "Unlike the TPA, the TJN works in the real world. We talk to real politicians," Funny - the 'real world' is a phrase I've only ever previously heard to describe a place where politicians have never known.

3. "But how wrong you are! The far right are the far right". DK is right here. It may be fair to compare two different groups and conclude neither has mainstream appeal. But to lump together classical liberalism or 'libertarianism' with conservative and socialist ideologies of fascism and National Socialism (or 'nazism') defeats the purpose of naming and grouping of ideologies. It makes no sense at all to group together conservative, socialist or liberal ideological sub-groups simply because they share minority public appeal. It is like classifying a chiauwawa and a squirrel in the same order simply because they are of a similar size!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A few comments:</p>
<p>1. &#8220;her £16,000 a year job&#8221;&#8230; &#8220;She simply won’t notice the difference. Her family as a whole will be £88 a year worse off&#8221;. Fortunately, I earn more than £16k a year, but sadly I&#8217;m not rich enough not to even notice £88. I suspect on her salary, she&#8217;s not rich enough, either.</p>
<p>2. &#8220;Unlike the TPA, the TJN works in the real world. We talk to real politicians,&#8221; Funny - the &#8216;real world&#8217; is a phrase I&#8217;ve only ever previously heard to describe a place where politicians have never known.</p>
<p>3. &#8220;But how wrong you are! The far right are the far right&#8221;. DK is right here. It may be fair to compare two different groups and conclude neither has mainstream appeal. But to lump together classical liberalism or &#8216;libertarianism&#8217; with conservative and socialist ideologies of fascism and National Socialism (or &#8216;nazism&#8217;) defeats the purpose of naming and grouping of ideologies. It makes no sense at all to group together conservative, socialist or liberal ideological sub-groups simply because they share minority public appeal. It is like classifying a chiauwawa and a squirrel in the same order simply because they are of a similar size!</p>
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		<title>By: gareth Lane</title>
		<link>http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-412422</link>
		<dc:creator>gareth Lane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Apr 2008 12:33:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-412422</guid>
		<description>There seems very little of substance behind the TPA. I believe the problem lies with the nature of soundbite reporting and the misleading name of this right wing lobby group. The main aim of the TPA, it appears, is to promote lower taxes, to the average news viewer the TPA  come across as crusaders against unjust taxation and fat cat politicians. The coverage the TPA receives reflects the need by the  media for provocative and easily digested McNews. Human nature always tends towards self righteous indignation before reason. The TPA is a propaganda machine rather than a lobby group I believe it's agenda is to create a political ambience favourable to right wing policies by using the issue of taxation as a means of crawling into the public psyche.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There seems very little of substance behind the TPA. I believe the problem lies with the nature of soundbite reporting and the misleading name of this right wing lobby group. The main aim of the TPA, it appears, is to promote lower taxes, to the average news viewer the TPA  come across as crusaders against unjust taxation and fat cat politicians. The coverage the TPA receives reflects the need by the  media for provocative and easily digested McNews. Human nature always tends towards self righteous indignation before reason. The TPA is a propaganda machine rather than a lobby group I believe it&#8217;s agenda is to create a political ambience favourable to right wing policies by using the issue of taxation as a means of crawling into the public psyche.</p>
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		<title>By: Longrider &#187; Pompous Prig</title>
		<link>http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-401414</link>
		<dc:creator>Longrider &#187; Pompous Prig</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Mar 2008 09:02:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-401414</guid>
		<description>[...] Tim W and Tim at the Conservative Party Reptile, I am now (unfortunately) aware of Richard Murphy. I wish I wasn&#8217;t, but, I am. Tim accuses Murphy of being lazy when defining people with whom [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Tim W and Tim at the Conservative Party Reptile, I am now (unfortunately) aware of Richard Murphy. I wish I wasn&rsquo;t, but, I am. Tim accuses Murphy of being lazy when defining people with whom [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Tax Research UK / A note to the Far Right</title>
		<link>http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-401171</link>
		<dc:creator>Tax Research UK / A note to the Far Right</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Mar 2008 21:37:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-401171</guid>
		<description>[...] note that the Far Right blog community are very upset with me tonight and are visiting this site in [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] note that the Far Right blog community are very upset with me tonight and are visiting this site in [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Tax Research LLP</title>
		<link>http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-401051</link>
		<dc:creator>Tax Research LLP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Mar 2008 15:47:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-401051</guid>
		<description>DK

But how wrong you are! The far right are the far right - and if they wish to argue with each others defintions of 'rightness', so be it. The world will still ignore them.

But in the real world the fact that there is no clear distinction between tax evasion and avoidance does matter. And it's this ability to see beyond the pointless argument on definition to the reality of life as it actually is that makes all the difference.

Richard

PS Please don't bother to reply - as you know, I find your style so offensive I won't be repeating this unusual exception of allowing you on here for a change</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DK</p>
<p>But how wrong you are! The far right are the far right - and if they wish to argue with each others defintions of &#8216;rightness&#8217;, so be it. The world will still ignore them.</p>
<p>But in the real world the fact that there is no clear distinction between tax evasion and avoidance does matter. And it&#8217;s this ability to see beyond the pointless argument on definition to the reality of life as it actually is that makes all the difference.</p>
<p>Richard</p>
<p>PS Please don&#8217;t bother to reply - as you know, I find your style so offensive I won&#8217;t be repeating this unusual exception of allowing you on here for a change</p>
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		<title>By: Devil's Kitchen</title>
		<link>http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-401045</link>
		<dc:creator>Devil's Kitchen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Mar 2008 15:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-401045</guid>
		<description>If you think that you have any credibility, Richard, you are seriously mistaken. Someone who is unable to discern the difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion is not going to be taken seriously by anyone with two brain cells to rub together.

The reason that the government will listen to you is because you tell them want they want to hear, i.e. that they should rake in much more tax so that they may waste it on yet more pointless, expensive and downright damaging schemes.

DK

P.S. Your conflation of Neo-Con and Libertarian demonstrates your ignorance of political theory: a fundamental of libertarian thought is the non-aggression rule, which hardly sits with the expansionist Neo-Con agenda.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you think that you have any credibility, Richard, you are seriously mistaken. Someone who is unable to discern the difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion is not going to be taken seriously by anyone with two brain cells to rub together.</p>
<p>The reason that the government will listen to you is because you tell them want they want to hear, i.e. that they should rake in much more tax so that they may waste it on yet more pointless, expensive and downright damaging schemes.</p>
<p>DK</p>
<p>P.S. Your conflation of Neo-Con and Libertarian demonstrates your ignorance of political theory: a fundamental of libertarian thought is the non-aggression rule, which hardly sits with the expansionist Neo-Con agenda.</p>
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		<title>By: Banditry &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Two bald men in &#8216;fight over comb&#8217; shock</title>
		<link>http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-401044</link>
		<dc:creator>Banditry &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Two bald men in &#8216;fight over comb&#8217; shock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Mar 2008 15:27:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-401044</guid>
		<description>[...] Research has an article criticising the TaxPayers&#8217; Alliance for being a bunch of rentaquote extreme-right-wingers who distort the facts to bash Labour, [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Research has an article criticising the TaxPayers&#8217; Alliance for being a bunch of rentaquote extreme-right-wingers who distort the facts to bash Labour, [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Lee</title>
		<link>http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-400455</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Mar 2008 19:11:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/03/17/who-are-the-taxpayer%e2%80%99s-alliance/#comment-400455</guid>
		<description>I'm entirely with you on this Richard.  I don't know the TPA (other than through their press coverage) but suspect that their agenda is not dissimilar to one or two other frequent commentators in the mainstream press.  

When I was Chairman of the ICAEW's Tax Faculty I got my fair share of coverage but it was nothing as compared with the tax spokesman for another accountancy body. One fundamental difference then (and now) is that he has apparent freedom to create quotes and to take positions that do not require anyone else's prior approval. A key part of his job is to get his name in the press as often as possible. ICAEW members complain that ICAEW reps are not as visible. The process is more complex and those who might be the face of tax for ICAEW are heavily involved in other activities, considering con docs, collating views, preparing responses and taking part in face to face discussions with HMRC, the Treasury and MPs.  These are considered to be more worthwhile activities than getting quotes in the press every day.

I can tell from your piece above that the distinction between TPA and TJN is partly due to a similar choice being made as regards how to spend time and effort. 

Mark</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m entirely with you on this Richard.  I don&#8217;t know the TPA (other than through their press coverage) but suspect that their agenda is not dissimilar to one or two other frequent commentators in the mainstream press.  </p>
<p>When I was Chairman of the ICAEW&#8217;s Tax Faculty I got my fair share of coverage but it was nothing as compared with the tax spokesman for another accountancy body. One fundamental difference then (and now) is that he has apparent freedom to create quotes and to take positions that do not require anyone else&#8217;s prior approval. A key part of his job is to get his name in the press as often as possible. ICAEW members complain that ICAEW reps are not as visible. The process is more complex and those who might be the face of tax for ICAEW are heavily involved in other activities, considering con docs, collating views, preparing responses and taking part in face to face discussions with HMRC, the Treasury and MPs.  These are considered to be more worthwhile activities than getting quotes in the press every day.</p>
<p>I can tell from your piece above that the distinction between TPA and TJN is partly due to a similar choice being made as regards how to spend time and effort. </p>
<p>Mark</p>
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